Discuss Anime

[VMR]

I've seen a cupple of animes in my years, but I've always completely and utterly hated the general anime fanbase (the people who make it a part of their personality), but my brain keeps telling me that watching it is alright because I'm a big, big fan of movies and books in general and anime is just an alternative way of producing those movies, after all.

I can't stand "anime culture" and I think it's retarded, but I can't deny some anime is probably f'ing godlike. The animes I've seen are Hellsing, Bleach, Naruto, Death Note and Fullmetal Alchemist. Before you start hating, I saw Hellsing, Bleach and naruto (from) back in the day when Naruto was at episode 20, so it's just something I've grown up with I guess.

Anyway, I was recommended to watch Death Note by a classmate, watched it and loved it. I think Death Note is a piece of art, mostly because it's easy to get into, it's logical and it's not primarily aimed at kids. I wanted to see if there was any other gems like DN out there, and I was recommended FMA several places on the internet and I decided I'd download it and give it a shot. Let's just say I was dissapointed.

Some FMA spoilers and a bit of a rant/rage:

• FMA has no story behind it, the universe is not specially interesting, and they never explain how alchemy fucking works. It's all so illogical and hypocritical I would actually rate it the worst thing I've ever watched. They never explain the limits to the power, how one becomes stronger, and none of the 'rules' they set up make any sense at all.
  
• Why is human lives special, what makes it differ from any sort of life?
  
• why is human transf. something special in the world of alchemy
  
• why is there a God in a universe where the only supernatural thing is SCIENCE
  
• why can't the main character even think of killing a person or using someone already dead and be so insanely childish when so much in the series is so violent and 'grown up'
  
• At one point the main character uses his own willpower as a stone why couldn't he use that to get his bro back? What exactly qualifies as a stone?
  
• If having a stone grants you immortality and not just expand your lifespam, why can't you sacrifice one person and live forever?
  
• Why is God not explained?
  
• Why is the only message we get through God something as childish as "There are no things as important as friends/family" ?
  
• How can the main character go through all that shit without growing a set of balls (talking about after the ending)
  
• Why did a guy thousands of years old get beaten by a normal kid after he even absorbed God himself?
  
• How do you perform alchemy through your hands?
  
• Why is it a law that you cannot create gold, when that shouldn't be a problem because gold is a chemical element in itself, and cannot be created from anything other than gold?
  
• Why does a human soul absorbed have anything to do with creating matter out of nothing?
  
• How does -whatever process attached a soul to a piece of armor- know exactly what is the armor and what is not? Could he have put any arrangements of items in a pile, written a seal of blood on it and it would've acted like the body of his bro? Could he have written the sign on a house and he would've became the house? Where does the energy required to move his limbs come from?
  

Why does that series have a 9.0 on IMDB, and nearly every other list? I feel like I was tricked into wasting hours of my life.

I don't have anything against anyone who liked it or anything, hell, good for you you got your time worth. The thing is that after watching it, I just totally lost the interest in ever looking for any anime ever again. If that thing is so highly rated, I don't trust reviews or scores, because I won't take the risk of having to watch something like that ever again.

To my question: Do you guys think you know of any good animes I could watch that's not stupidly childish, illogical or anything of the sort? DN is the only proper series I've seen, and I loved it and I believe there are other series as good as it out there. I'm cool with anything unnatural or supernatural, as long as it's not contradictory or stupid.

tl;dr

I just love a good story, but I don't like anime culture and I don't want to watch anime because it's anime. Do you guys have any suggestions for something you think stands out that you think I would like?

[Reap3r]

Did you watch brotherhood or normal FMA?

Well my first suggestions are:

Code Geass

Gurren Lagann(A manly story)

Guilty Crown

Gundam 00

Hajime no Ippo(Boxing)

Melancholy of Haruhi Suzumiya(is chronologically told)

Dragon Ball(Something I have grown up with so it has a higher value for me)

Kenichi the strongest Disciple(It made me go consider about watching/reading manga, it's about martial arts)

Rurouni Kenshin/Samurai X(Martial arts in middle age)

Clannad(Drama, Fantasy, without realism)

ToraDora(Drama)

Ergo Proxy

^Anime that made me feel a bit empty when it ended^

Isn't near DN but are also good to watch for story:

SAO

Kenichi the strongest Disciple

Soul Eater

JoJo Bizarre Adventure(1 manly tear)

Steins;Gate

Robotics;Notes

Bakemonogatari

Full Metal Panic(it's still in my head, so it's gotta be good )

Lesser:

Hyakka Ryouran Samurai Girls

Zero no tsukaima

Yuru Yuri

Also you might feel tricked but that's normal.

Everyone has his own tastes that's why you watch what you prefer.

Like clavus, he doesn't like moe.

Edited December 3, 2012 by Reap3r

[Griffon]

Death note is one of if not the best show to start watching anime. The reason its so highly rated is because so many newbies watch it. While this isnt necessarily a bad thing people tend to overstate its goodness because of it.

The entire last quarter where he goes emo is just bs on so many levels.

Then again the argument of whether or not he was on a power trip or trying to create a perfect world makes death note one of the best arguing points in any anime.

The best arguing point in anime is probably whether or not Lelouch from code geas was right or not.

To be honest thats usually the reason why code geass and Death note get compared so much is due to the duality of the protagonists.

@VMR "non anime culture animes,not stupidly childish, illogical or anything of the sort"

Most of what i posted before in my top 50 fits your criteria however specifically watch

Ghost in the shell

Code Geass

Gunslinger Girl

Noir

Madlax

Bakemonogatari

Hellsing Ultimate

Claymore

Cowboy Beepop

Crest of the stars*

Ghost in the shell*

Ergo proxy

Monster

Trigun

Spice and wolf

Toki wo Kakeru Shoujo

Phantom the requiem

Crest of the stars

Those should give you a good starting point for supernatural/action .

Edited December 3, 2012 by Griffon

[FishWithAHat]

I watch One Piece...

[Quert]

One Piece

Ok.

Edited December 3, 2012 by Quert

[Griffon]

Side note Kradars favorite animes ate basically any of the "; "animes then whetever else he happend to watch .

Edited December 3, 2012 by Griffon

[Clavus]

Some FMA spoilers and a bit of a rant/rage:

• FMA has no story behind it, the universe is not specially interesting, and they never explain how alchemy fucking works. It's all so illogical and hypocritical I would actually rate it the worst thing I've ever watched. They never explain the limits to the power, how one becomes stronger, and none of the 'rules' they set up make any sense at all.
  
• Why is human lives special, what makes it differ from any sort of life?
  
• why is human transf. something special in the world of alchemy
  
• why is there a God in a universe where the only supernatural thing is SCIENCE
  
• why can't the main character even think of killing a person or using someone already dead and be so insanely childish when so much in the series is so violent and 'grown up'
  
• At one point the main character uses his own willpower as a stone why couldn't he use that to get his bro back? What exactly qualifies as a stone?
  
• If having a stone grants you immortality and not just expand your lifespam, why can't you sacrifice one person and live forever?
  
• Why is God not explained?
  
• Why is the only message we get through God something as childish as "There are no things as important as friends/family" ?
  
• How can the main character go through all that shit without growing a set of balls (talking about after the ending)
  
• Why did a guy thousands of years old get beaten by a normal kid after he even absorbed God himself?
  
• How do you perform alchemy through your hands?
  
• Why is it a law that you cannot create gold, when that shouldn't be a problem because gold is a chemical element in itself, and cannot be created from anything other than gold?
  
• Why does a human soul absorbed have anything to do with creating matter out of nothing?
  
• How does -whatever process attached a soul to a piece of armor- know exactly what is the armor and what is not? Could he have put any arrangements of items in a pile, written a seal of blood on it and it would've acted like the body of his bro? Could he have written the sign on a house and he would've became the house? Where does the energy required to move his limbs come from?
  

So your main issue with FMA is that it's sci-fi / supernatural

A lot of anime are like this, and that's why I like them. Lots more interesting supernatural stuff than in actual TV series. Not every series put down a set of rules like Death Note, but as long as there's no glaring contradictions or stupidly convenient plot devices, it's not that bad.

Btw, there are two FMA series. The first one, and Brotherhood. The first one basically caught up with the manga before it was finished, so the creators just winged it and tied up their own story. Brotherhood is the faithful manga adaptation. Takes a few episodes before it gains some speed but it's the better version in the end (and the ending is a million times more satisfying).

Anyway, if you want more realistic / less in-your-face supernatural / no anime culture bullshit stuff, you should watch something like Monster (thriller, bit slow), Mushishi (slow but nice), Rainbow (gay name, but it's awesome) or Planetes (hard sci-fi).

After watching those you might warm up to other series. Or not, whatever suits you.

[Reap3r]

When you watch your first anime you mostly want something similiar,

but later, as clavus said, you warm up to other series, it might get out of the hand, you might like every series and actually become a otaku lol, buying anime merchandise, dem dolls, pillows or end up like the guy I linked on my status updates lol.

On a related note: Do we have any female watchers here ?

Edited December 6, 2012 by Reap3r

[Mr. Darkness]

I can understand why people don't like Naruto (since it's really stupid), but I can't understand what's the problem with Bleach. Bleach has storyline and maybe even if it doesn't end, it still has an interesting storyline, there's no shit like characters standing for hours thinking, there is a constructive future, a predictable and good ending + it's taste comparing to anime like Naruto which has everything completely random, crap storyline and absurd ninjas in it. At least in Bleach we know that Shinigami protect human world from Hollow and other dangers. Maybe I think so because I haven't yet seen anime better for my taste yet. But I really don't think that Bleach can be named "crap".

[Reap3r]

I can understand why people don't like Naruto (since it's really stupid), but I can't understand what's the problem with Bleach. Bleach has storyline and maybe even if it doesn't end, it still has an interesting storyline, there's no shit like characters standing for hours thinking, there is a constructive future, a predictable and good ending + it's taste comparing to anime like Naruto which has everything completely random, crap storyline and absurd ninjas in it. At least in Bleach we know that Shinigami protect human world from Hollow and other dangers. Maybe I think so because I haven't yet seen anime better for my taste yet. But I really don't think that Bleach can be named "crap".

This applies the same to the bleach haters, they cannot understand why you like it either. You are basically one and the same.

Hating on mainstream is also becoming a rage nowadays. The world is changing into tsundere.

[Kefeus]

I can understand why people don't like Naruto (since it's really stupid), but I can't understand what's the problem with Bleach. Bleach has storyline and maybe even if it doesn't end, it still has an interesting storyline, there's no shit like characters standing for hours thinking, there is a constructive future, a predictable and good ending + it's taste comparing to anime like Naruto which has everything completely random, crap storyline and absurd ninjas in it. At least in Bleach we know that Shinigami protect human world from Hollow and other dangers. Maybe I think so because I haven't yet seen anime better for my taste yet. But I really don't think that Bleach can be named "crap".

Bleach has its fair share of absurd moments and plot twists that Kubo probably just pulled out of his ass.

Don't know how many differences the anime has (dropped it around the 70th 150th episode, dem fillers) but the manga's storyline goes to hell after Arrancar arc imo.

Includes some spoilers from the manga.

Ichigo being half-shinigami, half-hollow, fullbringer, half-quincy, half-whateverthefuckkubopullsoutofhisass. Honestly, I wouldn't be surprised if Kubo just declared him a god.

I still read Bleach though, just don't enjoy it that much.

Edit.

I guess it's just tough to make a good long runner, you have to make some compromises on the story's integrity.

Edited December 6, 2012 by Kefeus

[Griffon]

Well my take on it is this. my favorite anime of all time isCode geass. Code geass is considered god tier anime . Its 50 episodes long over the 2 series. Its story is as tight as they get for a overly complicated counter logical thinking protagonists. Its not perfect but suffers from less overly contrived bullshit that death note gets later on.

Then just imagine the above with 200 episodes. The amount of plot twist bullshit and filler would wreck it. Why kill something good by squeezing it for every possible episode?

While i would love to get more code geass over 99% of other animes (as we all know lelouch is actually alive theory) any actual extension to Code Geass from the current setting would be a bad thing.

And this is generally why i say anything that has over 100+ episodes as a rule is a bad anime as it doesn't know when to quit.

I dont hate on mainstream just like my plot to have integrity.

D gray man is probably an exception but does suffer from filler.

Also if you add up all the episodes/movies following FM:A your probably at 100+ mark

Examples of good animes stopping.

Shakugan no Shana stoped at 3x 24 episode series +OVAS

Monster 64 episodes

Bakemonogatari breaks tradition with 15 episodes

Edited December 7, 2012 by Griffon

[Reap3r]

Well my take on it is this. my favorite anime of all time isCode geass. Code geass is considered god tier anime . Its 50 episodes long over the 2 series. Its story is as tight as they get for a overly complicated counter logical thinking protagonists. Its not perfect but suffers from less overly contrived bullshit that death note gets later on.

Then just imagine the above with 200 episodes. The amount of plot twist bullshit and filler would wreck it. Why kill something good by squeezing it for every possible episode?

While i would love to get more code geass over 99% of other animes (as we all know lelouch is actually alive theory) any actual extension to Code Geass from the current setting would be a bad thing.

And this is generally why i say anything that has over 100+ episodes as a rule is a bad anime as it doesn't know when to quit.

I dont hate on mainstream just like my plot to have integrity.

D gray man is probably an exception but does suffer from filler.

Also if you add up all the episodes/movies following FM:A your probably at 100+ mark

Examples of good animes stopping.

Shakugan no Shana stoped at 3x 24 episode series +OVAS

Monster 64 episodes

Bakemonogatari breaks tradition with 15 episodes

Your rule is bad because:

One Piece

Rurouni Kenshin

Dragon Ball Z/Dragon Ball

Pokemon

Hajime no Ippo

Gintama

And even more fine pieces of anime who are 100+ episodes long.

Really, you shouldn't judge on the episodes but on the damn story.

Edit1: Not to mention Bakemonogatari keeps getting new sequels, spinoff's or prequels. So it might also hit the 100+ episode barrier.

Edit2: Best HoTD video?

Edited December 7, 2012 by Reap3r

[Clavus]

100+ episodes doesn't necessarily mean a series is bad, but it does mean it's probable it expanded beyond its original premise and writers started making shit up, or they never change the formula. Which is what Pokemon / DBZ / Naruto / Bleach / One Piece fall under. It's cheap entertainment, they're equivalent to TV soaps. Considerable and believable character development is long dead at that point.

[Griffon]

I never said animes with over 100+ episodes are bad. Is just that as general rule of thumb they lack story integrity or character development after a certain point.

Rurouni Kenshin is barely over 100 besides i never said there weren't exceptions

The Gatari series

15(bakemono)+11(nisemono)+kizumono+nekomono = I highly doubt they will reach 100+

and Clavus also makes a good point.

[Quert]

.....

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One Piece

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And even more fine pieces of anime .........

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Edited December 7, 2012 by Quert

[Reap3r]

.....

.....

........

........

One Piece

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And even more fine pieces of anime .........

...........................................

........

[fanboyish rant]

Well I really liked how he decided to be a pirate on such a young age and how you see him grow up. The story of his crewmembers and how he made them his crew is also good. Then the war and how he lost his brother or how he is on his way to the New World and then he is shown the reality of how hard it is, making the whole crew lost to be finally reunited after 2 years.[/fanboyish rant]

You can keep loving steins;gate and death note while I will just love my One Piece. I would appreciate it if you would respect my choices though instead of making fun of it.

[Quert]

...

...

...

...

[fanboyish rant] << "story" >> [/fanboyish rant]

...

So does it really have an actual story??

Well.. actually it could even be true for the first 30 episodes, 50, 70... you can even say 100 and more , but what about the remaining over 9000 episodes then? Just saying, it has 575 episodes so far, at least 300-400 of them must be meaningless fillers (no, not side-stories or shit like that, COMPLETELY filler.).

Edited December 7, 2012 by Quert

[Reap3r]

[fanboyish rant]See for yourself for the story. I got into One Piece after continuing to watch it from episode 400. After that I got interested in what happened before so I went to watch from 0 to 399. That was my second try. First try I tried from 0 to ??? but I got bored somehow so I quitted midway. After my second try I regret nothing as it was a great trip and still is. If it ends my jimmies will probably be rustled since something that was for so long in my life has disappeared. Same with bleach, that kinda feeling.[/fanboyish rant]

[Quert]

See for yourself for the story.

Watched 10 episodes from start, then a bunch of random episodes from the middle, and then a few near the recent ones (500+). always the same result:

...But I guess that's why opinions are opinions...

[Reap3r]

Well you can't like everything equally Some will be less good as the ones you watch before, you just need to accept that and move on to find something better suiting your tastes. If you still can't accept it, think why it is still airing then.

Plus I love the fights:

Edited December 8, 2012 by Reap3r

[Reap3r]

HHHHOLY SHIT.

Part 2 of JoJo begins! I discovered it has the voice actor of gintama! I can't wait for the next episode already

[Clavus]

HHHHOLY SHIT.

Part 2 of JoJo begins! I discovered it has the voice actor of gintama! I can't wait for the next episode already

There's a few voice actors that do ALL THE ANIME. Guys like him are in everything.

[xeim]

Well i guess he is not in any danger of ever losing his job^^

[Griffon]

HHHHOLY SHIT.

Part 2 of JoJo begins! I discovered it has the voice actor of gintama! I can't wait for the next episode already

There's a few voice actors that do ALL THE ANIME. Guys like him are in everything.

Like how Crispin Freeman does all the good english dubbed anime,

Like how Aya Hirano not only sings all the good anime songs but also does all the famous moe/loli characters,

Like how Rie Kugimiya does all the Kawaii and tsundre out there.

I could go on but basically most of the people who are in good anime do ALL the animes.

Edited December 8, 2012 by Griffon